Subject	Why don't you explain this "reality" of yours then?
Posted by	SeedyROM on March 05, 2008 at 11:22 AM
	This message has been viewed 152 times.
In Reply To	16 votes to delete a post & obviously that isn't an accurate posted by Russell@Z1 on March 04, 2008 at 10:52 PM
Message	You say we bring shame, eh? Let's see, what is more shameful. Dozens of forum members with a sense of ethics that call out shady, backroom dealings or a company that buys up other forums to silence criticism and competitors, copies innovations at the drop of a hat and has a laundry list of complaints and fuckups in their own words? "Ive had it up to here with Z1...gotta vent" [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=2064249 ] "Z1 - terrible service" [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1860498 ] "Well, I'm never going to Z1 again..." [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1859144 ] "Warning: Z1 Motorsports..." [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1858689 ] "Z1 Did it again" [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1878438 ] red TT calling out Russell's shoddy service and excuses. Followup to above. [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1878731 ] Z1 forgets to change parts, puts other stuff in wrong then insults customer with lame excuse. [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1781273 ] "I have another post of bad Z1 packaging" [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1776601 ] Yet another Z1 Engine horror story (with much more below it) [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1691997 ] "Watch out for Z1!" [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1667407 ] More Z1 customer service screwups. VOLK GTC Group Buy [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1574313 ] "Are the Z1 built engines good?". Overwhelming response says NO. History of shoddy builds before, blames exmployees in other bookmarks. [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1876015 ] Z1 Turbo Clocking issues. Let the customers figure it out. [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1845872 ] UnrulyZ about changing his mind about Z1 over time. Russell says to "Search" and we do. Find lots more ugliness. [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1630941 ] "Surprise, surprise, Z1 fails again =/ Sorry to hear" [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1615817 ] "Z1 Steals Ash's old domain name from underneath him". Great guys to give your money to. [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1590599 ] Outrageous shipping on multi-thousand dollar turbos. Not the first time. [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1996692 ] "I do not recommend Z1 Motorsports" [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1561167 ] Covering lots of Z1 lies and false claims all at once [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1298824 ] The "We Developed this Trim Kit" Lie and calling out [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1148319 ] Z1 Admitted Copying of Products [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1446371 ] More admission of theft about T0M's Intercooler design [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1046788 ] TT.Net Side of the 350Z Engine Blow-up fiasco: Link to original on My350Z.com [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1473129 ] Joyriding in Customer Cars [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1190421 ] Justification from John as to Joyriding in Later Thread [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1151387 ] Customer Support Problems: Just a few of the many there are more below [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1580244 ] [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1574313 ] [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1418527 ] [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1384434 ] [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1278714 ] [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1193942 ] Nightmare Experiences [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1561167 ] [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1557330 ] [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1527047 ] [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1495297 ] [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1254893 ] Misc Stupidity [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1524004 ] [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1416390 ] [ http://www.twinturbo.net/net/viewmsg.aspx?forum=general&msg_id=1499917 ] I await your lame comeback. Boycott AMS Products - Killing Z32 product innovations, one quickly copied Chinese part at a time. www.SoCalZCrew.com - Come find out how we do it in the West!
Follow Ups	I wonder how a sponsor would feel knowing that his ads - ZEngineer 12:26:08 03/04/08 Checks and balances, Georgie. (n/m) - BradZ (FL) 12:28:36 03/04/08 I was wondering the same thing. (n/m) - Piranha(AZ) 12:31:07 03/04/08 I wonder how a forum owner would feel if one of the major - Guapo 12:32:20 03/04/08 indeed (n/m) - aliaZ 12:44:37 03/04/08 no offense, but he'd probably do something about it. (n/m) - inf 13:00:58 03/04/08 like what? (n/m) - aliaZ 19:17:17 03/04/08 remove them from being a sponser. (n/m) - inf 01:33:13 03/05/08 that wouldn't accomplish much (n/m) - aliaZ 09:08:03 03/05/08 So does Mike Smith own the forum or do Gregg and Damon? - SlicktopTT 13:04:36 03/04/08 some speculation ... - Guapo 13:23:16 03/04/08 Nobody mentioned Mike Smith - aliaZ 13:28:23 03/04/08 NOT a good comparison >>> - ztunerz 21:36:07 03/04/08 eh...you're right - aliaZ 21:58:48 03/04/08 >> - ztunerz 22:15:11 03/04/08 I dunno - aliaZ 22:21:56 03/04/08 also... - aliaZ 22:24:50 03/04/08 >>> - ztunerz 08:33:22 03/05/08 impressive (n/m) - aliaZ 09:09:36 03/05/08 They have hinted at copying the 300Degree Fuel Rails - SeedyROM 13:28:49 03/04/08 Seems they have a sense of humour.. - spicyZ 13:38:00 03/04/08 So do the best con artists and charlitains - SeedyROM 13:53:51 03/04/08 Nevertheles, it's an interesting social experiment - spicyZ 13:57:55 03/04/08 Absolutely. One would assume 300d has been paid for the - Guapo 14:03:26 03/04/08 Keyword = "assume" (n/m) - spicyZ 14:04:52 03/04/08 That is a risk each will have to take on for themselves. (n/m) - Guapo 14:07:12 03/04/08 The tribe has spoken. (n/m) - spicyZ 15:04:50 03/04/08 Sure - SeedyROM 14:11:41 03/04/08 Lemmings. Whatever bandwagon the majority happen to be on - ENVYMYZ 15:31:57 03/04/08 In defense of Lemmings... - Jackie 02:48:08 03/05/08 I've seen those hints too. Let them try to copy it... - SlicktopTT 13:52:39 03/04/08 Did you even ask why Damon stopped supply briefly? - SeedyROM 13:59:05 03/04/08 yep (n/m) - aliaZ 14:00:09 03/04/08 Listen. You and I have both been around here a long time - SlicktopTT 14:35:50 03/04/08 They have been getting deleted for a while now. - en5 12:32:55 03/04/08 I was curious about that also. (n/m) - MistressZ 12:33:09 03/04/08 They've said numerous times that all the VTDs and - dogpile 12:35:26 03/04/08 This is a great deal of free publicity. (n/m) - Sleeper_TTZ(SeKy) 18:28:08 03/04/08 Exactly. So they lose one or two potential customers from - dogpile 19:58:34 03/04/08 Was the ad for the AMS rip-off manifolds? - BigTDogg (MA) 12:42:32 03/04/08 I would feel proud to spread the lyrical genius that is - ZEngineer 12:50:32 03/04/08 Nice! (n/m) - nemo1080 14:44:22 03/04/08 No. (n/m) - spicyZ 13:10:06 03/04/08 Now I'm curious... What was the ad for then? - MixManMash 15:59:03 03/04/08 Clutch kits (n/m) - spicyZ 16:03:22 03/04/08 RPS or DxD knock offs? (n/m) - MixManMash 16:05:06 03/04/08 sponsorship pays for the banners you see at the top of the - aliaZ 12:43:17 03/04/08 this is the correct answer. - ZEngineer 12:46:29 03/04/08 To allow deletion is a conflict of interests. - AZHeat 13:16:18 03/04/08 Z1 can pull their sponsorship if they so desire. - aliaZ 13:57:05 03/04/08 Bingo (n/m) - SeedyROM 13:57:44 03/04/08 yep - Bezza 16:24:38 03/04/08 604Z has not been the same since it was sponsored. - mscurfield 17:14:20 03/04/08 that's what I hear (n/m) - aliaZ 17:21:05 03/04/08 604z is ghey (n/m) - Wilks. 17:52:00 03/04/08 tsk tsk mike- are you bitter? - inyrdrmz 23:58:30 03/04/08 no 604z wasnt created as an advertising venue - inyrdrmz 23:51:11 03/04/08 not initially, no - aliaZ 10:41:54 03/05/08 you're wrong. i think i would know... - inyrdrmz 19:25:27 03/05/08 How is it conflict of interest? - Bezza 16:48:21 03/04/08 Conflict of interests because they allow it to - AZHeat 17:47:58 03/04/08 That would be conflict of interest - Bezza 18:19:09 03/04/08 Special treatment because money changed hands? - AZHeat 18:48:48 03/04/08 yep - Bezza 19:15:04 03/04/08 that would be unethical to give sponsors - aliaZ 18:24:24 03/04/08 That makes no sense at all. A business or club always - AZHeat 18:43:32 03/04/08 This is a hobby site supported by sponsors, not a business - SeedyROM 18:57:11 03/04/08 3zc is more civilized than this... - treese88 19:19:20 03/04/08 its hard to say with how much gets deleted over there (n/m) - aliaZ 19:32:43 03/04/08 say something bad about Z1 and POOF its gone. (n/m) - nissanguyz32 19:52:23 03/04/08 I think it's a huge leap to say twinturbo.net is a business. (n/m) - Dustin 19:12:12 03/04/08 doesn't matter. It takes money to keep it up. (n/m) - AZHeat 21:15:33 03/04/08 ? My car takes money to keep it up. - TT XTZ 12:03:14 03/05/08 exactly (n/m) - na300zx (OH) 13:35:07 03/04/08 This has been covered over and over its not the MODs - 5280Z_nightstalker 12:51:23 03/04/08 wow, thanks for clearing that up for me...*sigh* - ZEngineer 12:55:32 03/04/08 I am sure probably 50% of people here would never buy AMS - 5280Z_nightstalker 13:02:46 03/04/08 I wouldn't be so sure. - robo (sebring1970) 13:20:08 03/04/08 Seems pretty much bang on to me Robo. (n/m) - spicyZ 13:22:54 03/04/08 Sad but very true - SeedyROM 14:16:10 03/04/08 Who? (n/m) - BigTDogg (MA) 14:43:33 03/04/08 Re: Who? - SeedyROM 15:09:27 03/04/08 I would tell those guys to bring their product to market - SlicktopTT 14:49:50 03/04/08 Remember when you posted that last year? Didn't learn did ya - SeedyROM 15:05:43 03/04/08 I work at a law firm that gets patents, trade marks etc.. - SlicktopTT 15:39:04 03/04/08 No, your head is up your ass. - Spongerider :) 16:11:04 03/04/08 Occupation: CPA - SeedyROM 19:07:52 03/04/08 Yep, getting a patent is money and time consuming. - ZCulture 19:44:07 03/04/08 Where else would you want to prevent the sale? I would - SlicktopTT 19:53:18 03/04/08 Proviso you can defend it. - ZCulture 20:01:05 03/04/08 Yes. I am their VP of Finance for the firm and 13 other - SlicktopTT 19:50:38 03/04/08 Patent is really not an option. - Bezza 20:08:45 03/04/08 Pseudo-Ethical. That is the perfect way to say it. - Sleeper_TTZ(SeKy) 18:16:51 03/04/08 Rofl.. come on n00b... (n/m) - spicyZ 13:11:08 03/04/08 when did the general forum turn into a girls gossip corner? - volcomstone550 15:16:58 03/04/08 Haha x2 (n/m) - nissanguyz32 17:03:40 03/04/08 nothing gets by you. (n/m) - Spee 23:17:50 03/04/08 Just like the free market economy allows AMS to pursue - robo (sebring1970) 13:11:15 03/04/08 Who said anything about AMS? The ads are for clutches.. - spicyZ 13:12:41 03/04/08 Your going to call me a noob but you cant even figure it out - 5280Z_nightstalker 13:16:35 03/04/08 lol! You should try sitting on your hands for a bit. Really. (n/m) - spicyZ 13:19:03 03/04/08 I dont know what your deal is i am not here to fight or say - 5280Z_nightstalker 13:27:05 03/04/08 All the pissed off members here about AMS but not - AZHeat 13:21:17 03/04/08 If Mike spent as much time as we do on this forum - aliaZ 13:32:27 03/04/08 Mike Smith is an intelligent person - TT XTZ 13:59:59 03/04/08 His work speaks for itself. - AbsolutZ (OH) 14:04:34 03/04/08 As I said before, if that is the case, then it's bull ____ - BigTDogg (MA) 14:11:41 03/04/08 You don't really think that's the only reason do you? - SeedyROM 14:26:30 03/04/08 Which was referenced here... - BigTDogg (MA) 14:39:39 03/04/08 So you're saying that's not reason enough. (n/m) - SeedyROM 14:57:12 03/04/08 To VTD classified posts of a forum sponsor... no - BigTDogg (MA) 15:41:00 03/04/08 What if they weren't a sponsor? - SeedyROM 18:55:06 03/04/08 Now were talking downward spiral... - BigTDogg (MA) 20:12:16 03/04/08 the fact that they are a sponsor is irrelevant. (n/m) - Spee 23:36:37 03/04/08 See above (n/m) - BigTDogg (MA) 09:01:48 03/05/08 you're an idiot (n/m) - Spee 23:29:41 03/04/08 Which begs two good questions.... - LJZTT 16:49:31 03/04/08 As many votes as Greg and Damon think is sufficient. (n/m) - Guapo 16:53:31 03/04/08 16 votes to delete a post & obviously that isn't an accurate - Russell@Z1 22:52:41 03/04/08 sadly, the past actions with AMS and your relationship - Halo Z 10:48:34 03/05/08 Why don't you explain this "reality" of yours then? - SeedyROM 11:22:23 03/05/08 Its because Z1 is not part of "The cool guy club" - Madhatter10-6 13:43:54 03/04/08 What don't you understand? - SeedyROM 13:52:29 03/04/08 Re: What don't you understand? - Madhatter10-6 14:03:59 03/04/08 It's unfortunate that I have to say it - SeedyROM 14:08:19 03/04/08 i get it now! - Madhatter10-6 14:18:45 03/04/08 lol, don't worry, your eyes will adjust soon enough :) (n/m) - na300zx (OH) 14:53:55 03/04/08 LoL! - Spongerider :) 16:32:35 03/04/08 nice collection of bookmarks (n/m) - ghostinator (fl) 16:17:57 03/04/08 Bookmarked (n/m) - Audicon 16:40:58 03/04/08 I totally agree about it being a free market and I think - na300zx (OH) 13:52:52 03/04/08 **SOME** members are VTD ing posts - LJZTT 21:48:36 03/04/08 Newsflash: Read 1/3 of these posts and gain some insight - BigTDogg (MA) 13:55:29 03/04/08 Re: Its because Z1 is not part of "The cool guy club" - Spongerider :) 16:19:51 03/04/08 Sponsors never controled our Classifieds. You new here? - SeedyROM 13:49:50 03/04/08 ^^ Read that Madhatter - na300zx (OH) 13:57:13 03/04/08 Just to clarify, I am referring to the beginning about - na300zx (OH) 22:27:55 03/04/08 WOW, They are now Posting MS manifolds and 300 degree fuel - kwun 14:15:33 03/04/08 It's called a "fishing expedition" (n/m) - SeedyROM 14:18:32 03/04/08 I don't understand what the deal is. - TriniTT 14:49:16 03/04/08 Now they are even violating the two posts per day rule :) (n/m) - na300zx (OH) 14:51:28 03/04/08 Good, every time I do a search in classifieds I always - Ashman2k2 14:57:19 03/04/08 and they told me my vote wouldnt count! lol (n/m) - MOZZ 14:59:28 03/04/08 they have no feelings (n/m) - moxie (SF) 15:05:11 03/04/08 I like having the right to vote. - datzun 15:22:24 03/04/08 VTF under FAQ "how increase your hit count" ^^^ - Cap927(Boston) 15:47:07 03/04/08 you do realize ... um ... nah, of course you do. (n/m) - Guapo 15:56:55 03/04/08 yes I do, and I hope this whole post gets deleted - Cap927(Boston) 16:12:39 03/04/08 I'm not convinced. (n/m) - TriniTT 17:43:35 03/04/08 sometimes when I'm alone at night - ZEngineer 16:36:55 03/04/08 you are one sick puppy, but I love ya!! ;) (n/m) - Cap927(Boston) 17:00:37 03/04/08 This has no effect on George's hitcount (n/m) - aliaZ 17:09:34 03/04/08 It is wrong to hinder free trade and flow of information. - Gordo 93TT Daytona 16:40:26 03/04/08 Where do you draw the line Gordo? (n/m) - Guapo 16:50:24 03/04/08 I don't know where the line is drawn. But, I am confident - Gordo 93TT Daytona 17:25:03 03/04/08 Some think the right thing is already being done. (n/m) - Guapo 18:01:21 03/04/08 Steve, you may be right. But I wish there was a way for - Gordo 93TT Daytona 20:39:26 03/04/08 indeed, but sometimes fighting the good fight isn't pretty (n/m) - Guapo 20:46:13 03/04/08 Touche... (n/m) - Gordo 93TT Daytona 20:53:02 03/04/08 2nd (n/m) - LJZTT 16:53:50 03/04/08 Well said and so true.....this had just gotten too out - Gold Z 16:54:19 03/04/08 Very well stated, couldn't have done it better. Thanks. (n/m) - Yoshi 17:37:27 03/04/08 Are you a lemming, or someone who is willing to stand up for - boileralum 17:46:43 03/04/08 Are Damon and Greg weak for accepting Z1's - Barry (NJ) 18:09:17 03/04/08 Weak? No. However their sponsorship buys ad space at the top - Guapo 18:17:32 03/04/08 I don't thik they are weak either, and I don't think Z1 - Barry (NJ) 18:44:02 03/04/08 Another question... - Barry (NJ) 19:07:25 03/04/08 A lot of the threads discussing it were deleted - SeedyROM 19:14:07 03/04/08 NIMBYism at its finest - aliaZ 18:12:04 03/04/08 maybe that's the problem - LJZTT 22:04:17 03/04/08 what we're witnessing here is the Walmartization - aliaZ 22:17:34 03/04/08 Look I agree, but if the market will bear a demand for those - LJZTT 22:28:20 03/04/08 unfortunately, "thanks" won't pay the bills - aliaZ 22:41:50 03/04/08 How many does it take? - Bezza 18:25:25 03/04/08 More than "a few" as Gordo said, that's for sure (n/m) - SeedyROM 18:59:35 03/04/08 It's still a minority when compared to the # of active - spicyZ 19:14:04 03/04/08 Sure, but we don't own the site do we? - SeedyROM 19:16:28 03/04/08 There's really no easy answer - spicyZ 19:25:49 03/04/08 VTD is not that much of a big deal even if it is wrong. - Bezza 19:46:56 03/04/08 Protest is just as important as censorship. - Bezza 19:19:13 03/04/08 There's no shortage of other forms of protest around here (n/m) - spicyZ 19:27:24 03/04/08 I believe it's 3. (n/m) - BlackholeZ 19:00:31 03/04/08 Those 3 "X" marks do not in any way indicate the number (n/m) - SeedyROM 19:02:50 03/04/08 Well good, I always thought 3 votes was awfully small. - BlackholeZ 19:17:51 03/04/08 Nah, it's easy to make that assumption. I did the same - SeedyROM 19:27:13 03/04/08 This is a private website, not the United States of Z1 - SeedyROM 19:24:59 03/04/08 Who's "standing by and accepting it"? - spicyZ 19:31:14 03/04/08 exactly^ (n/m) - LJZTT 22:10:17 03/04/08 I think you're on the wrong conversation dude. - SeedyROM 23:52:52 03/04/08 Please point out where I was "bitching and complaining" - spicyZ 07:59:02 03/05/08 You have been lumped into that group, for whatever reasons - SeedyROM 19:17:46 03/05/08 I don't get this :/ - ZDUCTIV 16:50:17 03/04/08 Re: I don't get this :/ - SeedyROM 19:04:04 03/04/08 This thread is large. That is all. (n/m) - en5 17:14:39 03/04/08 Yeah, not sure why Z1 continues to support this site w/ that - Yoshi 17:34:55 03/04/08 Go to 300ZXClub.com where the users have ZERO say - SeedyROM 18:50:20 03/04/08 borg collective - aliaZ 18:56:01 03/04/08 so if it just comes down to numbers.. - Halo Z 18:19:50 03/04/08 2nd (n/m) - Zski 19:34:36 03/04/08 Everything seems to be working just right - Jonez 18:30:27 03/04/08 Can't we all just get along! C'mon peeps! (n/m) - Turbonium 300Zx 18:48:27 03/04/08 am I missing something? I don't see where Z1 is selling the - S.Watson 18:57:58 03/04/08 That's a small part of it we're guessing but - SeedyROM 19:01:42 03/04/08 here is a little insight - aliaZ 19:10:22 03/04/08 I tend to agree with Robo in the fact that there is a large - S.Watson 19:31:31 03/04/08 Is the limit 2 listings per day in the classifieds? Maybe - Neogenesis 20:35:14 03/04/08 he should feel like an ass for bringing it on himself. - Spee 23:05:12 03/04/08
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